I am asking because I want to give members a real argument who say that people that leave the church weren't really active and devout members and just were looking for a way out.
I have served in the Aaronic Priesthood as a priest, teacher, and the deacon's quorum. I was 1st and 2nd counselor of the Deacon's Quorum.
I did not serve a mission.
I also did home teaching, collected fast offerings, and volunteered once at the Johnson farm.
My history sucks I know...
This is just the kind of mormon mindset that drove me nuts! All are supposed to be equal within the membership of the church, but clearly based on the talk and actions, there is clearly rank!
Ever been to a temple dedication? There's only so many who can participate INSIDE the temple for the dedicatory prayer and be in attendance shoulder to shoulder with gods chosen servants. We went to a dedication where the temple was adjacent to the stake center. Tickets were given to only worthy members of age who could attend the temple, but alas only so many would be invited INSIDE the temple while the remainder of the "worthy" were assigned to the stake center to listen to the proceedings.
So there we were sitting in the pews of the stake center chapel while the "higher ups" got to be in attendance with the GA's in the temple. It didn't really bother me so much, except for this one situation. You see, a BISHOP had somehow been left OUT of the temple and was sitting with his wife and kids in the chapel too! I didn't think anything of it until they came into the chapel prior to the start of the session and removed HIM only so he could sit with his buddies INSIDE the temple.
What really irked me is not only did they not take his family, but what this man later commented about it. He said that it was like he was chosen for a higher seat in the kingdom when he was called into the temple. He was trying to drive home the point of the importance of the temple, but sounded like he was bragging about being chosen over others to be able to participate INSIDE the temple. GAG!!!
Frankly, I don't give a fuck what calling you had or whatever callings anyone else had. It's only the uber TBM who thinks so self righteously of himself or herself that feels more worthy than others because of their good works. IT's BULLSHIT!
Active members seeing members of High Rank leave the church only give them more resolve to be diligent in not being lead astray like the so-called elect are being lead astray. It doesn't change the argument. You're still thinking like a Mormon. Be glad your history doesn't include any other leadership!
Seriously, I hope others here don't give a fuck about the positions they held in the church either.
SM, some of us really bought into the lie. When my husband was called as bishop I truly felt like I had been forgiven of 'all' my sins; I had arrived and was worthy.
My 'pride' was usually over his callings and not my own because it felt as though I was getting in by hanging on to his shirt tails. Even our mission calling was because HE was the one with work experience to enable him to run the mission office.
The point you make about them telling us that all callings are equal (that is just to get you to accept a nursery calling I swear) is obviously not true. If you get called as a nursery leader does your family travel 12 hours to be with you on the day you are sustained? Members travel far and wide to be present when a loved one becomes a bishop or stake president.
I too understand the question posed here regarding the position, but I do agree that the members will just think that it is fulfillment of prophecy - Satan is getting the very elect. Good point. There is no argument good enough for those who want to believe the BS.
I agree that there is no argument good enough for those who want to believe the BS. The leaders have thought of answers to just about any argument or situation.
However, so far, there are some questions I've asked my TBM family members, that have not been answered. Questions such as "Why does God not heal Amputees?", and "Why would an intelligent God not prefer to associate with those that use the intelligence he gave them to the best of their ability, rather than those that just believed by blind faith?"
Actually, they have answered none of my questions!
I may be naive, but I think my questions will nag at their minds, and eventually, some of them will start questioning the church.
You say "resort to profanity" like it's a bad thing. What the fuck Nathan? You offended by swear words? Get the fuck over it man!
I never said anything about not liking the discussion at all! You have totally missed the point of my post. There are many reasons members rationalize in their own non-thinking minds of why others leave so they can feel better about themselves. Frankly, I just dont give a shit what they think, cuz it's their problem. I presented a point of view on the topic that maybe others may not have considered and shared a real life story to demonstrate it.
One more thing, when a person says FUCK, it doesn't mean they are always angry...it's an expression that conveys a wide variety of meanings beside the sexual connotation.
You make some good points Truth. For those of us who 'hate' the church, at times we feel so much anger that we cannot see anything good that came out of our membership in the church, especially when leaving it means so much hurt and pain. I HATE BEING LIED TO!
You are right nobody can take away what we learned (some things need to be unlearned) and nobody can take away what we accomplished. I learned to sew. BUT, the church didn't teach me all I know and they get no credit for what I learned to do. I LEARNED it; didn't have to. Some women don't know how to sew after years of being in Relief Society, so I think that I would have learned and accomplished all that I did during those 39 years anyhow - in or out of the church. If so, I wouldn't have to unlearn all that I don't want still stuck in my head.