To preface I would just like to add that this is a difficult topic to articulate so I will do my best. 


As I have many friends and family members still in the Church I am finding it very frustrating to keep their wish of remaining silent and supportive of their decisions. Said silence is supposedly the quintessential display of "tolerance" in our society, a permission of religion.   


If you look up the definition of tolerance you can actually find many widely varying definitions. Most are as follows:

"a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices,  race,  religion,

  nationality, etc.,differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry."

Notice how the definition here assumes that the two parties differ by opinion, not fact. To me, the Church is more than harmless opinions. It is mobile, it hurts, it steals, it deceives, it knocks on doors and judges. In this case it is not a difference of opinion but of fact. Facts which one party (mormons) refuse to acknowledge.  Tolerance in this case and by such a definition cannot be defined. What then is tolerance?

To further illustrate imagine a kkk headquarters next to a mormon church. It may be socially acceptable for the surrounding community to oust the kkk but not the mormon church. Both are racist by definition (a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement). If you need more info on the topic read 2nd Nephi and many other church publications. Yet in the end the mormon church remains as it is more cunning and less physical about its racism then the kkk. 

I personally don't feel there are shades of gray to racism. Racism is racism no matter how you view it.

So in this context are we supposed to remain tolerant until the point which racism becomes physical and violent? 


I realize that there is nothing I can say, nor any fact I can present to change anyones views. What I have come to realize, because that church has the capacity to hurt and deceive people outside its doors, it is wrong to remain silent. 

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Duchess: The above comment of yours, ("I just remember at one point I was a Mormon who...."), has been on my mind a lot since you posted it 3 months ago. It's such a kind position to take. Not always an easy one though.


Why should I be tolerant of the intolerant?  The only way TBMs show tolerance to us EX-MOs  is if  we just STFU and let them babble on. Check out this video, it shows the "tolerance" of Utah Mo's.

Fast fwd to 2:52 to see the Atheist Missionaries in action.

That's funny! And sad -- will they see the irony in slamming their doors (and shaking their brooms) at proselytizers and then raising their sons to be proselytizers? 

To me tolerance is allowing another to practice their beliefs as long as they do not try to force their beliefs on to another.

excellent definition.

Tolerance is a hard thing to peg. I'm trying to constantly remain sensitive to my still LDS friends that I love, but still I feel that at times I should/ need to show my disagreement with certain points. I try to tread lightly because in reality they aren't gonna want to hear much. I can say I disagree, but not hit them with everything I've learned b/c that just come across as anti which doesn't go over too well.

So tolerance to me is respecting that they believe differently then I do. As long as they don't infringe on my rights or the rights of others (I am very vocal about things like gay marriage, history of racism, etc, that was true even when I was a TBM).

I hear you, sometimes the conflict isnt worth it. However, I do think the "hurt feelings" is a cop out that people use to justify their cognitive dissonance. Its not you hurting their "feelings" in other words, its the inconsistency of their beliefs with reality that is uncomfortable. The discomfrt is translated as hurt feelings. But I thunk confrontation demonstrates respect for a person, it shows you have confidence that they are strong and mature enough to handle honesty.

I have noticed an undercurrent in Mormon culture that looks down upon conflict and anger. What is tat about? Anger and conflict can be very healthy!

True. Whatever happened to "you can choose whether you're offended [or not]"? ;-)

Tolerance is about real love for mankind...real love is about respect the others for how they are and not for what they are.

The only thing I'm not tolerant about is for people, countries or institutions who don't respect Human Rights.

Well, that is the whole paradox of the LDS church. I am no longer a member but my family and friends are. I respect their choice to live their lives they way they do but I can't seem to get that same respect back when I chose to live my life the way I do. Funny since they preach that they are a perfect people who live by the "new commandment' Love One Another as I have loved you...that song and scripture are missing a few word...something along the lines of "Love one another so long as they are living the way the LDS think they should!!"

Tolerance is a learned thing.  We aren't born with it.  Over the past 24 years since leaving the church, I've gone from being just darned pissed off, saddened, and now "tolerant" of my 90 year old dad's faith in the church.  Perhaps more than tolerant, as he finds daily activities and ways to serve others that give him purpose, so I am happy for him.  Ten years ago I wouldn't have said that.  Last week Focus On The Family refused to support legislation that would make bullying illegal.  Not the playground antics we all live with, but the stuff that makes teens kill themselves.  This, because they'd have to become tolerant of gays and lesbians, and wouldn't be able to trash them in public like they love to do.  But something in me says being tolerant of even that group is better than sitting around being pissed off.  Tolerance from Webster"  to respect the conduct, opinions, beliefs, etc. of others without sitting in judgment on them.  To be able to take a drug without suffering harmful effects .  ( Marijuana?)


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