Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Xiban on November 29, 2011 at 1:57am

Hi...I left after reading and research about historical facts. I'm historian and after my research I was sure the Church was totally FAKE. There wasn´t any doubt in my mind.

Permalink Reply by La Vonne on July 20, 2012 at 9:13am

No question! So much plagiarism and deceit. Definitely a different gospel. I am curious, did you become a  Christian?

Permalink Reply by Nicholas on November 29, 2011 at 3:29am

There are just too many contradictions in the doctrine and between the leaders for me to believe that a god is running the church. 

Permalink Reply by Mimosa on November 29, 2011 at 6:40am

I was innocently browsing church-type websites, when a popup ad asked, "Questioning Mormonism?"  And promised to reveal things about the church. In my arrogance I clicked on it thinking I knew everything possible about Mormonism in my 40 yr active membership.  WRONG!!

 

It led me to the YouTube video about the Book of Abraham, which shocked me badly so I kept following links.  That day I also read every wive's profile from the website, wivesofjosephsmith.  Tears were falling down my cheeks at what these poor women suffered through.  At that moment, I had an epiphany, "There is no way Joseph Smith could be the prophet." and it was like a felt a shield cracking and falling away from my brain, thin like eggshells.  Suddenly I could see things I never had before and it drove me on a study frenzy to learn everything possible.  As painful as it was to learn the truth, I am grateful to be reborn with true vision. 

Permalink Reply by Liber Mens on December 1, 2011 at 3:01am

Wow!  I love hearing stories like this of people with open minds who follow their questions. It takes courage and integrity to do this.

Permalink Reply by Dan on January 17, 2012 at 9:29pm

I agree but Mormons forgive their prophet just other believers forgave Abraham for giving his wife to the Pharaoh, Mosses for killing a man, Joshua for killing every man, women, child and the livestock as he conquered the land, Elisha for calling a bear to eat the children , the harlot adulteress and pregnant teen that are in the lineage of Jesus and many more. So if you truly want to believe you ignore the truth and rely on fables

 

Permalink Reply by tethercarguy on September 2, 2012 at 9:02am

Talking about the different prophets and who they killed, puts Joseph Smith in good company.He killed several men at Carthage in a gun fight resulting in his death. I totally agree that Mormons forgive their prophet, ignore the truth and rely on fables, but probably more times than not, they never heard the true stories in the first place. I was never taught:

Joseph Smith killed several men (as he went like a lamb to the slaughter)

Joseph Smith translated the phony Kinderhook plates

Joseph Smith claimed an angle would kill him unless a 14 year old girl was given to him

The DNA of the Native American Indians does not match that of Lehi's ancestry, making the BoM bogus

The papyrus does not translate to the Book of Abraham as Joseph Smith claimed

This is just the tip of the iceberg!

 

Permalink Reply by DoctorDahesh on September 2, 2012 at 3:54pm

If you were in jail, and had a gun, and a mob came to kill you, your brother, and your two friends, and they just killed your brother, I think you'd be justified in firing into the crowd to save your life. I doubt any jury would convict you.

My religion teaches that we are all judged by our "actions"; not what doctrines or creeds or fables we believe or do not believe. All else other than "actions" are irrelevant. So, The Book of Mormon can be bogus, the Kinderhood Plates can be bogus, and Joseph Smith could be bogus, it does not matter on how we are "judged" by the Laws of Karma; which are "blind" as to what religion, church, caste, creed, what we believe or don't believe. If Mormons live good lives, and do good, they will be rewarded, not by a supernatural being, but by a Universal Law: what goes around comes around. Evil brings evil, and good brings good.

Permalink Reply by tethercarguy on September 2, 2012 at 4:10pm

I agree with you about Joseph Smith shooting into the mob. What I don't agree with is the church saying "He went like a lamb to the slaughter" and not tell the whole story. The church has always portrayed their history extremely slanted and leaving out HUGE details to investigators. Full disclosure is certainly not a word associated with the LDS church. I also agree that we will be judged, assuming there is a God, on our actions and that does not bode well for the church and their deceptions.

PS I find it humorous the comparing of Joseph Smith to Jesus. Jesus went to his crucifiction healing the ear back on the soldier after an apostle cut it off. Joseph goes to his killing several men.

Permalink Reply by DoctorDahesh on September 2, 2012 at 5:13pm

Of course, the Church always tries to portray itself and Joseph Smith as perfect, sinless, without guile. I suggested to Mormon leaders long ago, very long ago, to teach young Mormons, very young, that Joseph Smith fired a gun in defending himself and his friends (Hrym was already dead but Joseph may have thought he was still alive).  I don't blame Joseph Smith for shooting at men who were trying to kill him and his brother an dfriends. Not at all. Of course, the Church should have included that fact in its manuals long ago, then it would not have the problem NOW.

I've studied Mormonism like probably nobody else. I'm convinced that Joseph Smith did not write the Book of Mormon. It contains Isaiah variants found only in the LXX (Septuagint). More likely, Ethan Smith wrote it. He was the "Moroni" that David Whitmer and his mother saw in their barn, with the plates. The plates were written in Tironian Latin.  The Melchizedek Priesthood was claimed by a group in Pennsylvania who baptised for the dead. The Order of Zion.  Peter Whitmer and his brothers lived three miles from there.  I think there is a LOT more too it than simply writing a book to make money.

Church's are not judged by the Universal Law of Karma. Individuals are.  It is a Law, not an individual. We don't stand before some person sitting on a throne. Things happen to us according to the Law. Certainly, noble men like David O. McKay and Spencer W. Kimball will be rewarded.  Joseph Smith was a seducer, but not a murderer (unless you include Lilburn Boggs---who deserved to be shot). I think Brigham Young has a LOT to pay for.

The Universal Law means that if we do evil that attracts dark matter to our soul, or karma, and if we do good, or relieve suffering or suffer ourselves, we repel dark matter from our soul. The very light souls go to higher dimensions, and the heavy souls, with a lot of dark matter, return to this dimension; some better off than others.

If the Gospels are accurate, Jesus intended to be killed, in order to arise from the  dead. Joseph Smith never intended to be killed.  "I am going like a lamb to the slaughter" is not mentioned in the weeks and months following Joseph Smith's death. I doubt he ever said it.

Permalink Reply by tethercarguy on September 2, 2012 at 6:19pm

You mentioned David O. McKay and Spencer W. Kimball were noble men. I would disagree. To lead a church that decieves people is not noble. At one time I wondered if the Prophets realized the church was bogus. After seeing, I believe it was Hinkley, denying that the church teached or believes, "As man is God once was. As God is man may become."  He danced aroun that and denied it. An out and out lie.  

Permalink Reply by DoctorDahesh on September 4, 2012 at 4:48pm

Most leaders of the Church are not scholars nor historians. They themselves may be "shocked" when they hear some things from the past. The point is, they put it out of their minds, and we couldn't.  Certainly, Hinckley lied and tried to cover up things. We know that. Joseph Fielding Smith did. Brigham Young did. Joseph Smith did. There is simply no evidence that David O. McKay or Kimball did. It's just not there. Did they think Joseph Smith was a fraud? I don't think so. If they did hear contradictions, they simply didn't let it bother them. Some people are like that, contradictions don't bother them in the least.

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